an icbm that could reach the western united states, guam, hawaii and, of course, alaska. what they haven't done yet is demonstrate the ability to tip it with a nuclear weapon. look, the payload in this rocket was about 100 kilograms, about 220 pounds. at their stage of nuclear developments, they would -- could miniaturize a nuclear weapon down to it, but they would need to miniaturize it down to about a ton, about 1500-2000 pounds and lift that into orbit. right now they're a long way from that, but that's not the point. jenna, it's now an engineering problem for north korea and not a scientific and technical problem, and that poses a real risk to the united states. jenna: so you say they're not there yet, but again, that's not the point. >> right. jenna: so what do we do about it, general scales? >> yeah, there are a couple of things. the first thing that i think we must do is expand our psychological operations campaign against the north. we tried this about 10, 15 years ago, it was effective, and it was stopped. look -- jenna: what is that, psychological operations? >> in other words,